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Maybe Democrats could have tried doing literally anything that people wanted
They were too cowardly to enact any change, and just tried to keep the status quo.
Refused to act against an attempted coup by the previous president, and suffered for it, as they rightly should.
Zionists are people. (Not good people).
“Wow you wanted the Democrats to do popular polices? You must be a Republican!”
This dumbass argument again.
You need an opposition party then. If you keep blaming the voters you are going to keep digging your own grave. In America you have only two parties and legit no opposition party. In this way guess what, FASCISM always wins.
Also Please honestly explain to me, how in the fuck is fascism lite ever going to beat fascism?
Bro, DSA leaders have flat out said that that is too much fucking work. They could have a seat at the table, but that comes with the expectation that they will sit down, and in good faith, do some fucking work. But they don’t want a seat at the table. They want to be handed the table, all the chairs, and the keys to the building table is sitting in, and then thanked for saving the world without having to lift a goddamn finger. Obama spoke very openly about his time in office, and said that in his first year he was full of fire and optimism, and was all gung-ho about getting Americans universal healthcare or at least get us on the path to it, and very quickly learned how to be pragmatic. He never gave up his ideals, never changed his values, but in his first year he learned that he couldn’t just magically sign a paper and boom, everyone’s on Medicare. He had to do stuff that most DSA people find boring or tedious, like sitting down with Senators and Representatives and working on a plan together to get something started.
¿Por Qué No Los Dos?
When it was the day of the general election and we were guaranteed to either get mainstream Democrat or Trump 2.0: The Revenge Tour, I could not morally justify any vote that didn’t minimize the chances of Trump winning.
But in the present day, and in the time leading up to the election, god damn the Democrats feel so worthless. Their party probably needs to be completely rebuilt even before the much much worse Republican party. You can’t have the Nice Conservative Party vs the Mean Conservative Party when the latter has gone off the deep end.
But also in the present day, it may already be too late. So keep on writing stern letters, insider trading, and raking in the fundraising while your desperate constituents still have some money and willingness to do something!
This is definitely a liberal take. I don’t agree with those who didn’t vote for Kamala, but removing responsibility from people running her campaign when there are obvious glaring issues such as retracting all populist messaging and appealing to non-existent right wingers voting against Trump was a real stinker to say the least. It’s okay to blame politicians who didn’t win for not winning.
God, this is the take I want to see. I’ll take criticism of my voting habits, but it should be proportional to my power. Democrats have more culpability.
You got a fascist elected. Hope your moral purity was worth it
I’m still waiting for whatever the hell is supposed to happen after electoral politics has failed us, because it has.
I was told by people pushing for people to not bother voting in 2024 that voting was meaningless and that Trump would be no different than Harris. People told me that the solidarity of grassroots organization was the only way to see any real change, and that we had to reject the DNC at all costs. Well, we rejected it. What now?
PS: I don’t even mean this sarcastically or to win internet points – that are even more meaningless than on reddit – on this site. I’m actually asking, what are we doing now that this happened?
Oh this again? Democratic Party: has our Neo liberalism, refusal to enact progressive policy, and backing of a genocide alienated progressive voters? Disenfranchised voter: damn it we told you a thousand times yes! Democratic Party: No it’s the voters who are wrong.
Hey, hey, marketing yourself as Fascism Lite: Low Sodium as opposed to Fascism Original Recipe has to work at some point, right?
Gotta keep tugging for those republican votes. We may need to adopt some republican priorities in order to get those voters, but its all for a good cause right?
The democrats were wrong, they fucking lost!
The Party cannot fail, it can only be failed.
spoken like a true cult member.
I’m guessing they’re being sarcastic
I voted for Kamala. My parents and grandparents did as well. I do not feel that the democrats were/are doing jack shit to court new voters. The party itself expects to just be the status quo and have people vote for it. Whether people want to admit it or not, the point of being a progressive party is to be… how do I put this… PROGRESSIVE.
Oh yeah, make no mistake, the Dems are fucked.
It’s just that in '24 we had an option between “continue having a flawed democracy” and “put a literal fascist in power”, and a lot of us are still sore over folks who insisted that choosing the latter was some form of leftism. They weren’t a major force in the general electorate, but here on Lemmy, they were certainly loud, so a lot of bad feeling remains.
You clearly don’t understand leftist thought. Voting for a cop, a warmonger and a complicit child-kidnapper is incompatible with many leftists’ beliefs and values. Continued aversion to actually listening to criticisms of the Dems and DNC from the left is why your beloved party is crashing and burning.
You clearly don’t understand leftist thought.
No, I absolutely do. They preferred the fascist to working with the dreaded ‘shitlibs’, just like Thalmann.
Nazi punks fuck off.
Call me a Nazi all you like, it doesn’t make me a Nazi. In fact, you moralists should take that log out of your eye and actually look at the world your status-quoism has generated
Call me a Nazi all you like, it doesn’t make me a Nazi.
No? You just welcomed in fascism because it pleased your prejudices and preconceptions. Sounds pretty indistinguishable from most Nazis to me.
In fact, you moralists should take that log out of your eye and actually look at the world your status-quoism has generated
“Wow, the world is bad. We should make it worse.”
Brilliant plan. Millions of LGBT Americans and tens of millions of Ukrainians thank you for your ardent support of fascists taking power. I’m sure those dying for lack of supplies from USAID are thrilled as well, as well as poor Americans who can’t afford the massive increases in costs of living and are already living paycheck-to-paycheck, and the crackdown on unions.
What a brave leftist world you’ve helped create. Maybe if you lick fascist boots a little more, it’ll become even better.
I also find it amusing that I’m getting called a ‘moralist’ because I advocated the utilitarian option. What fucking insanity.
Millions of LGBT Americans
You’re talking to one, and no, the Democrats have backstabbed us at every opportunity. Especially at trans issues, which they love to capitulate on as a bargaining chip for getting their capitalist donors more money.
Maybe if you lick fascist boots a little more, it’ll become even better.
If you walk outside and throw a brick in the face of a cop, you can talk to me about what it means to be a bootlicker.
I also find it amusing that I’m getting called a ‘moralist’ because I advocated the utilitarian option.
You advocate for action based upon a spook? Sorry, that makes you a moralist. You decided that “maximizing utility” was the moral choice, and that again makes you a moralist. Perhaps you should write a sternly worded lever-pulling manifesto to send to your congressman?
Yes, stop thinking and just follow the herd! That’s surely the solution! \s
Thankfully I live in a state where my vote doesn’t matter at all. jfc.
How many years can the libs keep this up?
Enjoy the turbo-genocide ethnic cleansing!
Non-contributing rage bait. The Democrats were wrong. The Democrats still are wrong. And the Democratic presidential candidate was infinitely better than her opposition.
Nuance motherfucker do you speak it.
Nuance motherfucker do you speak it.
“If they dislike my party, they must support the other party, nothing else exists, right?”
In a two party system, especially when there’s no clear “I don’t like either” option then yes, nothing else exists. When you don’t vote you’re not saying “I don’t like either party” you’re saying “I don’t care which party wins”. If you don’t care which party wins then you’re in support of both parties.
And it’s telling that so many people didn’t care whether the dictator or Democrats won, isn’t it? If you’re making the case between yourself and a megalomaniac, and the majority of Americans shrug and go about their day, what the hell are you doing wrong?
Ever heard of third parties? I’ve voted Green Party since I could vote. There is the Libertarian, Reform, Constitutional, and several other parties.
Yeah, they’re the non-vote parties. FPTP voting always devolves down to 2 parties, see Duverger’s Law. Even if by some miracle a 3rd party wins (and continues winning) they will eventually kick one of the previous 2 parties out and take their place as the new party in the 2 party system. In practice if my memory doesn’t fail me voting 3rd party hasn’t mattered for over a century because the 2 main parties are so entrenched, so voting for 3rd party is more or less throwing away your vote.
Well I would rather throw my vote away then vote for murdering sociopaths
As an outsider, I think you’re not on the side of the meme that you think you’re on.
If not voting for Trump wasn’t enough for Harris to win, she sure didn’t act like it. “Nothing to change” from the policies of the guy who was forced to step down wasn’t what the people wanted to hear.
Well, they sure have change now! Enjoy.
I mean he was asked to step down because of the worry that his mental faculties, not due to his policies. Remember, it was right after his first debate with Trump. The following debate, Kamala roasted Trump.
Hold on, last election he refused to say so explicitly, but he repeatedly implied he wouldn’t run for a second term and described himself as a bridge candidate. Then he demanded a second term at the last minute.
How did he “demand a second term in the last minute”? The assumption is a president will run for re election.
Unless they run in the first election as a bridge candidate and then, after being elected, refuse to confirm that he won’t run again for multiple years.
Edit: y’all can rewrite history all you want and insist that the party cannot fail because it can only be failed, but he said what he said: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/mar/10/joe-biden-michigan-rally-kamala-harris-cory-booker
Yeah, except for the whole genocide thing. But mostly college kids protested that. You can just beat up those.
I don’t get how this relates to my post… Could you reword your comment
There were many of people who demanded Biden to step down, as he supported Israels genocide against Palestinians. The reasons you describe cover the party elites and many people in general, but Bidens support for genocide and Harris continuation of that support were part of the reasons why the Democrats lost to Trump again.
Stepping down was mainly due to his debate performance, not the genocide. Why do I believe that? A shit ton of people still voted for Kamala. It wasn’t enough for her to win, and it was less than Biden s votes last election, but a majority of Biden voters from his election still voted for Kamala.
Originally we aren’t talking about why he lost ( i do agree, perhaps incorrectly, that Kamala lost enough support because of her position on Gaza). Originally we were talking about why he was forced to step down, which again was due to his debate performance.
RedditLemmy users love their internet slacktivism. These mfers will type out a 10,000 word comment on a five year old post before they will vote.Yeah. Voting is
biggest fingerquotes Michael Myers can muster
“Activism”
/s
We agree that spending one’s time typing internet comments is less effective than voting.
Did the DNC’s strategy work? No? Then the Democrats were wrong.
It’s their job to convince voters to vote for them. And if they won’t take responsibility for failing at their job, then they’re on course to do the exact same thing in 2028 and get the exact same results.
Did the DNC’s strategy work? No? Then the Democrats were wrong.
So you’re saying that no matter what happens, it’s never my fault. Yay!
(/s)
The voters faced a trolly problem. While Trump was busy tying more and more people to the track, the Democrats left a few on the track, and the voters decided that they couldn’t stomach the choice, so they sat it out. And now we get this.
The Democrats have blood on their hands, sure, but so does every person who didn’t vote yet bemoans the Trump presidency.
If you think the trolley problem has an obvious solution, you do not understand the trolley problem.
The democrats objectively were wrong.
They lost the election.
That’s the only measure of right or wrong that actually matters.
They literally had only one job and they fucked it up again.
They literally had only one job and they fucked it up again.
American voters had one job. To responsibly inform themselves and make the best choice for the welfare of their nation. They failed to do so, again.
We can’t control the American voters so complaining about them doesn’t actually accomplish anything.
We can, however, change the Democratic party to better align with the voters.
That should be everyone’s focus.
“We can, however, change the Democratic party to better align with the voters.”
Can you though? It’s not for lack of trying but y’all don’t seem to be having much success with this.
Or maybe your methods just need work. Instead of just bitching and moaning about the DNC on the internet you can actually get off your gaming chair and run for office at the local level and convince real people to vote for you.
Can you though? It’s not for lack of trying but y’all don’t seem to be having much success with this
What?!
Ken Martin is a huge win as chair…
Like, we already changed the party. It happened.
That’s why I went from constantly shit talking the DNC to promoting it.
Neoliberals bet everything on Biden/Harris, and now they don’t have control of the DNC anymore.
The only people who shouldn’t be happy about that is conservatives
Elections are a popularity contest with weird rules more than anything…
But the DNC kept trying to force uncharismatic candidates with conservative policy down voters throats, and stole funds from state parties to focus on that costing us down ballot races making losing have even more consequences.
They haven’t just been putting all our eggs in one basket.
They put it in the basket of a 20 year old shitty child’s bike and then put Biden on and pushed him into the interstate.
Voter can’t fail a party, but Dems have been failing their voters for decades.
I’m optimistic Martin will change that, enough to give him a fair shot and not just a month.
Voter can’t fail a party
Nope, but they can sure fail their country. And did.
I’m an adult, so I’ll take an uncharismatic candidate over a traitor felon rapist who deconstructs our federal government, destroys our allegiances, fucks up our economy, and bends the knee to Russia.
But I accept that a LOT of Americans are simply children trapped in adult bodies.
I’m an adult, so I’ll take an uncharismatic candidate over a traitor felon rapist
Great.
But like a whole shit ton of people tried to warn for the last year now, Biden/Kamala we’re enough to beat trump.
We’ll need all the voters again, we won’t need anyone that was involved in either of their campaigns though. So why shit on the literal tens of millions we need in defense of less than an airplane’s worth of people who hightailed it back to their mansions?
You get that, right? We don’t have to run uncharismatic conservative candidates to beat trump, it’s literally the worst option we have
We can just run a charismatic candidate with a progressive campaign promise like we did with Obama. Did you forget that?
So why shit on the literal tens of millions we need in defense of less than an airplane’s worth of people who hightailed it back to their mansions?
You answered your own question.
That airplane’s worth of people come and go. They won’t be relevant next time around.
The tens of millions of people that failed to do their civic duty and inform themselves responsibly, waiting around instead for a party to court them until they felt appeased, will still be there, not doing their civic duty next time around.
And that is why the fault rests on American voters, not politicians that come and go.
So you think insulting them and badgering them that they shouldn’t have a single standard then letter by name…
You…
You think this is the most effective move to get them back in the party?
You don’t even kind of think what would be most effective is explaining to people how the DNC works and what the new chair is like would work better?
Cuz like, I just have a bachelor’s in psychology, so I would absolutely love to hear what I’m missing where you think the best way to recruit people in the fight against fascism is yelling insults.
If you want to help, actually want to help, can you do what will actually work and not work against the party?
I know the PUMA people are still around and bitter from 08, this is starting to feel like that. I tend to just block those people tho so I can concentrate on what translates to Dem gains in the federal government
